White to move. Can White save this game? How should White proceed?
Chess Daily News from Susan Polgar
Choosing the right continuation
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White to move. Can White save this game? How should White proceed?
GM Susan Polgar…just a friendly suggestion. I like the fact you’re willing to post chess puzzles online but it would be nice if you could post the FEN text below the diagram.
This way posters can copy and paste the FEN into the chess program of their choice and fire away at solving the problem. As such it is…it’s difficult to solve them because we have to manually enter the piece location onto the chessboard.
I do not know what FEN is and I do not know how to do it. In addition, the point of these puzzles is for people to be able to solve them in their heads just like in real game condition.
Best wishes,
Susan Polgar
http://www.PolgarChess.com
Hi Susan,
You are a member of chessgames.com.
Several of the users there can in just moments teach you FEN.
It is just a series listing of blank squares and White or Black piece designations.
I hope that you, Paul and your family all have a wonderful New Year!
1 Qh3 seems hard to meet, e.g. 1 … f5 2. Qxf5+ Qf6
3. Re7+ Kg8 4. Re8+ and mate in one or two moves via Rf8 or Rh8.
Why would you want to enter these puzzles into your computer? The point is to solve them on your own, as if you were at the chessboard.
FEN? Feh.
GM Susan Polgar…since I was the one who offered the suggestion…here’s what I’m talking about:
8/1p1r1kp1/1p3pNp/2rp3P/1n1q4/p3R1P1/P4P1K/5Q2 — w 0 1
This is the FEN version of the graphic image you posted. It’s a simple text that allows the user to grab and paste it into their chess programs to analyze the various positions.
Onto your suggestion about “solving them in their heads”. That’s a commendable skill in chess and it’s something I agree with…however solving chess problems is not really OTB chess play. Although I see where you’re coming from…it’s actually better solving them via computer. Why? Because it forces the chess player to concretely analyze the problem and figure out the correct way of playing the position. In some cases…the chess problems can be proven to be incorrect! I’ve seen such instances happen when solving problems from newspaper articles myself.
I am far from an expert, but I don’t see any defense to Qd2. The threat is Re7+ followed by mate. If Rcc7, then Re8 seems to lead to a simple mate as well.
Perhaps I have missed a key black resource.
As far as the FEN goes you guys are way out of line!!!
A] These puzzles MUST be solved manually!
B] You should NEVER use a computer to solve them!
C] Asking Susan to learn some new technology is WAY out of line just because you find it more convenient and enjoyable!
D] Chess fans who enjoy computers should go ELSEWHERE, to another blog perhaps!
E] This blog is not meant for NEW IDEAS, it is old school!
In summary you must learn to use the blog the way it is! Please don’t submit ideas to make it more enjoyable, interesting or entertaining.
Jean-Michel said
QUOTE
I am far from an expert, but I don’t see any defense to Qd2. The threat is Re7+ followed by mate. If Rcc7, then Re8 seems to lead to a simple mate as well.
Perhaps I have missed a key black resource.
/QUOTE
I think you missed a key white resource. How does the queen on f1 reach d2 in 1 move?
1. Nh8+ (Kf8 2. Ng6+ Kf7 3. Nh8+… perpetual move draw) Kg8 2. Re8+ Kh7 3. Ng6!.. and I don’t see any response to prevent 4. Rh8#
Thanks.
theres are two possibilities for this problem.
1) Nh8+ kf8
Qh3 Rd8
Qe6 black any move
Qf7 mate
2) Nh8+ kg8
Re7+ Kh7
Qh3 black any move
Qf5 mate
The whole problem relies on pushing the king to the back row and forcing a mate.when i say black any move it means that any move black makes doesnt change the outcome of the game.
To add to the above comments. why do you need a chess board to figure out moves. you have to do the moves in your head man. come on.
theres are two possibilities for this problem.
1) Nh8+ kf8
Qh3 Rd8
Qe6 black any move
Qf7 mate
2) Nh8+ kg8
Re8+ Kh7
Qh3 black any move
Qf5 mate
The whole problem relies on pushing the king to the back row and forcing a mate.when i say black any move it means that any move black makes doesnt change the outcome of the game.
To add to the above comments. why do you need a chess board to figure out moves. you have to do the moves in your head man. come on.
Qh3 is the best bet forcing the black Qxe3 and eventually leading to mate.
Qd2 can be countered with Rc8, though not sure who will hold the advantage as game goes on.
I guess the “cheats” who use chess programs to solve Susan’s puzzles also use engines when they play opponents online
* sighs* no wonder I lose so often, I cam’t think of any other reason, apart from being a patzer that is! ROTFL 🙂
Chess was so fun 30, 20, 15 years ago without computer. We are like in Matrix nowdays and Kramnik was finally not Anderson.
QUOTE
Anonymous said…
theres are two possibilities for this problem.
1) Nh8+ kf8
Qh3 Rd8
Qe6 black any move
Qf7 mate
2) Nh8+ kg8
Re7+ Kh7
Qh3 black any move
Qf5 mate
/QUOTE
2) If white play Qh3 black have Qf2 chess.
Soo best are ng7 and rh8 mat
white plays Qe2 and if Rc8 then 2.Re7 +. I think with advantage…
I like theses puzzles for some reasons. First i try to solve it without any support. If i’m not sure, i transfer the position to my little chess piece set, adjacent to my laptop, and move pieces around, using a memo from time to time (by the way – the training effect – especially visualization – is strongly enhanced for me, if i can see the position in 3-D) – after all, i try to post my solution – if it is already there – i have no need to. Then i’m used to transfer the position and analysis to my chessbase software. I add interesting lines, e.g. found by other bloggers, and if the puzzle is very interesting, i do a final analysis with my fritz 7 and add comments. I’ll give you a typical example file for the current puzzle in pgn.
BTW: It is a great visualization exercise, to MEMORIZE a given puzzle position and rebuild it from memory either in your software or on a real board WITHOUT FEN, of course!
greetings
[Event “tactical pattern”]
[Site “?”]
[Date “2006.12.28”]
[Round “?”]
[White “N”]
[Black “N”]
[Result “*”]
[Annotator “Vohaul”]
[SetUp “1”]
[FEN “8/1p1r1kp1/1p3pNp/2rp3P/1n1q4/p3R1P1/P4P1K/5Q2 w – – 0 1”]
1. Qh3 $1 {black has no sufficient defense against the various mating threats} ({by the way, a pratfall would be} 1. Nh8+ Kf8 (1… Kg8 $4 2. Re8+ Kh7 3. Ng6
$18) 2. Ng6+ (2. Qh3 $2 Qxe3 3. fxe3 Rc2+ 4. Kh1 Rd6 5. Ng6+ Ke8 6. Qf5 Rdc6 { is a clear win for black}) 2… Kg8 3. Re8+ Kf7 4. Qe1 Qxf2+ 5. Qxf2 Kxe8 6.
Qe1+ Kd8 7. Qxb4 $14 {and the chances are about equal}) ({even worse is}
Qe1+ 1. Qe2
Rc8 $1 {black has a forced win now} 2. Re7+ Rxe7 3. Qxe7+ Kg8 4. Qe6+ Kh7 5. Qxc8 Qxf2+ 6. Kh3 (6. Kh1 Qf3+ 7. Kg1 Qd1+ 8. Kg2 Qc2+) 6… Qf1+ 7. Kh2 (7. Kg4 Qc4+) 7… Qe2+ $1 8. Kg1 (8. Kh3 Qxh5+ 9. Kg2 Qxg6) 8… Qd1+ 9. Kg2 Qc2+ {the resulting knights endgame is hopeless for white}) 1… Qxe3 { there is no better move for black} (1… Rd6 2. Re7+ Kg8 3. Re8+ Kf7 4. Rf8#) ( 1… Kg8 2. Re8+ Kf7 3. Rf8#) (1… Rd8 2. Qe6#) (1… Rc6 2. Qxd7+ Kg8 3. Re8+ Kh7 4. Rh8#) 2. Qxd7+ Kg8 (2… Qe7 3. Qxe7+) 3. fxe3 Rc2+ 4. Kh3 $18 { black has no defense against Qe8+ followed by Qh8#} *
Black appears to be defenseless after Qh3
Hi Susan. Here is an explanation on FEN:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forsyth-Edwards_Notation
I use the free Winboard program to get the FEN notation of a position.
Hold on now guys. The FEN is very useful. I do not use a chess board. have not used a chess board in probably over 10 years.
I use a chess board on my computer. Having fen allows me to quickly transfer the position correctly and then work on the problem from a view that I am used to.
As it happens now, I always have to transfer the position to the computer anyway and it takes time and sometimes I have errors.
Lastly it is never appropriate to use a computer and then make comments on the position. but certainly it seems ok to use a computer and not post anything about the solution.
Also if the reader would like to save up the positions then he needs the fen to save them up for later practice. again the fen is very useful.
Lastly after the answer is given on the website, nothing wrong with a quick check on the computer.
I remember going through the book by Hays on over 1100 chess puzzles. Did the book at least 3 times. I would mark down all the positions I disagreed with. In those days I did not have a computer to check out the solutions. Even today I wish I had my old list of what I thought were mistakes in the book just to see if I ever was right. just more fun.
so please loosen up guys. the suggestion to print out the fen is a good one and it has nothing to do with so called cheating. for that we use blue tooth under the hat.
Thanks! I’ve learned something new today – didn’t know FEN text…
It seems useful to me, and I suppose I’ll use it.
On the other hand i don’t see why we should ask Susan to make the FEN text – why not make it ourselves?
BTW: I believe there’s a little error in the FEN text above…
Shouldn’t it be:
8/1p1r1kp1/1p3pNp/2rp3P/1n1q4/p3R1P1/P4P1K/5Q2 w -– 0 1
The w (whites turn) before — (“no castling for either side)
I’m really surprised that SP hasn’t heard of FEN, especially as it appears in pgn files. I suspect she knows the notation but doesn’t know it’s called FEN.
I’m also surprised that she didn’t just type ‘FEN chess’ into Google: well, I’m assuming she’s heard of Google.
Some learning points here about chess, Google and life.
I look forward to Youtube videos of Tommy teaching SP about FEN, SP writing her first FEN down, SP speaking at the Inaugural meeting of the FEN Foundation etc
Latin ‘educare’ = ‘lead out’, so let’s us learn by starting from where we are. If that is with chess engine rather than with board, then FEN is useful. QED
Nh8+ Kf8 Ng6+ and white gets a draw
Nh8+ Kg8 Re8+ Kh7 Ng6 and white wins with Rh8#